Quattro all life!
More safety and much better driving experience

 

@ p@olo
Even if it meant dropping the comfort package and technology package high?

 

I don't know what they mean exactly. Here in Italy is different. If the tech package is the Navi, I would go for it. Don't know what comfort package is, but I think I'd drop it definitely for a Quattro

 

I would also say quattro, but for a different reason.

If you are coming from a BMW you will be used to RWD.
I have not seen report of the FL FWD 3.0TDi yet but big torque through the front wheels is a recipe for traction control and lots of it.

Especially from RWD I think you may not like this much.

Also depending on model 3.0TDi is 205 bhp FWD or 245BHP Quattro, although there are extra losses in Quattro that is a big 20% jump in power, and 245BHP is really the design power for this engine; the lower power is just compromising the engine for a small amount of economy.

One last thing is that if you stay with auto with Quattro you get STronic which is frankly brilliant compared to Multitronic which is a CVT box, not bad but still CVT.

Of course it is always easy to spend somebody else's money

 

Sameila,

Welcome. My view comes from being a 2.7 Multi Cab owner (effectively the predessessor to the 3.0 tdi multi)

Your decision on whether to go for Quattro largely depends on two factors; how you drive, and whether you likely to drive in a lot of snow/changeable winter conditions etc.

If you want to get the very most out of your cars handling and traction in the summer e.g taking it to its limits - then quattro will probably be your better choice. If however, you rarely do so, then Quattro will probably end up being an extra expense that you will never see the gains from over 2 wheel drive.

Quattro provides greater traction, in snow etc, although winter tyres will probably be equal to a Quattro on summer tyres in the same conditions (my view)

I personally feel that whilst Quattro would have been a benefit (driving on snow), the amount of time I have actually needed it (once) doesn't justify the extra cost, whereas I use my SatNav, and AMI, daily weekly, so am getting the best out of my money.

If I had to choose again, and had a budget limit, I'd buy the 3.0 (2 wheel drive) Multi again without hesitation. If I could afford the Quattro without dropping the Tech pack and Comfort pack, then I'd go the extra mile and pay for Quattro.

Finally, if I recall correctly the comfort pack includes interior lighting (glovebox etc). Just do a quick search to see how many folks on here are frustrated that they didn't get this option.

Anyway, hope the info above is helpful, but in the end it's your choice.

Good luck:thumbsup:

Cheers

 

@gruffle & Mulski

Thanks for both these views. Very helpful. It's making me think hard about what I want

I don't really hammer my car flat out but I do like to push it round the corners a bit. Don't get me wrong, I've never had the back end sliding out or anything, but I do like the feel of the BMW when it takes a corner. It's completely different to any car I'd ever driven before this. I think that's my main concern, that the A5 won't corner as well and I'll feel disappointed with it. On the other hand, I'm really looking forward to owning my first auto, first V6, first engine above 2.0l, etc. I'm actually looking forward to the relaxed drive and with the top down. It wouldn't be such a bad thing if I relaxed a bit more in my car.

Mulski, you'er right about using all the extras on a daily basis as appose to the quattro just when it snows, etc. There's some real good gadgets on there that will keep me amused for a while and make it seem like I've got more for my money each time I drive.

Comfort Package = Convenience Package, sorry. It's the electric seats with memory, folding auto dimming door mirrors with memory, auto dimming rear view mirror, etc.

 

Have you driven either variants?

This is the only real way you will be sure, because whatever anyone says - including me - are personal and subjective views. Personally, if I was going to drop c.£35-40K on a new car, I'd sure want to drive each first to be sure of my decision.

Cheers

 

You'll use the AWD rarely. There is lots of evidence to suggest winter tyres are safer than AWD on ice and snow. I've posted a YouTube video elsewhere on here with the details.

Spend your money on the things and treats you'll use each day.

Enjoy your new car.

 

You'll use the AWD rarely.

Disagree.
To suggest Quattro is only used in snow misses the point entirely.

It is used at ALL times and fundamentally changes the driving characteristics of the car.
In particular it means you have ALL the power available at ALL times.

Note that afaik there is not a single Quattro owner here that would prefer to go back to FWD, even though for most snow is nothing but a novelty. Look around though and you will find several FWD owners grumbling about traction and torque steer.

The discussion of toys vs performance is a good one and ultimately will be personal choice of course.

For me I probably wouldn't forego the Tech Pack or the B+O, but the comfort pack wouldn't bother me a jot.

Mulski has the true answer: make sure you drive them both, it is a lot of money to spend and regret the decision.

 

I would not even consider a FWD Audi A4/5/6 or 7.

Quattro makes a good car great. You will enjoy it every minute you drive it.

Go for the 3.0Tdi Quattro with S Tronic. Better car, better engine, better gearbox. MAy cost a little bit more but worth it!

Never had a BMW... don't like them these days.

Cheers

RG

 

RG, so in a real daily driver commute etc situation, would you be willing to forgoe your Tech Pack and Convenience Pack and still be happy with your cars interior options over x years?

Cheers

 

Have two quattro's and many before, drive both options and decide for yourself.. 3.0 torque demands Quattro in my view, either that or lots of front tyres...

 

When I bought my FWD 2.0 TDI I opted out of Quattro because I saw it as a safety feature for slippery roads (ie snow and torrential rain), and couldn't justify the combined cost of the option and lower economy.

Since I bought this car and have had the chance to "experience" it a bit, I've certainly had a fair few slips and skids. Wheelspin on "enthusiastic" launches, little bit of sliding at speed around tight corners, etc. To be clear- this was pushing the car, not every day driving.

After having owned the FWD, I'm now getting a replacement vehicle (long story) and opted for Quattro 2.0T so that I could have a little more fun. If my 2.0TDI lost traction (even before remap), then I'd hate to think what the 3.0 might do.

I (personally) would still specify a tech pack above Quattro because it really is something that you use no matter how you are driving. I would prioritise Quattro above Convenience, as it can be retrofitted at a later date if it really is that important to you (folding mirrors are especially simple).

Additional consideration is that I've never heard any good reviews of the Multitronic box. Audi are phasing it out, that's for sure. The best review I've heard is that "the new ones aren't as bad as the older ones circa 2007-8"... which would put me off that. Though I am an avid manual driver so I was already pessimistic before I read these complaints.

/2c

 

Whatever you do really make sure you test drive a Multitronic if you are thinking of that. Some love it, most hate it. As gruffle says, quattro = S-Tronic an altogether different driving proposition.

Oh and quattro every time for me with anything over 200hp

 

Mulski, yes, I've tried 2.0 TDI, 3.0 TDI Multi & 3.0 TDI Quattro but only on test from the garage for 10 mins each. It's only when I get used to a car that I pick up the pace a little and that's when you feel how it really performs. I have to say this purchase is a little bit rushed as I had to get it through before the "open season" offer ended and because of this I haven't been able to test a car over the weekend. The thing that stood out on all the cars I tested over the BMW was refinement and quality and it's this that I'm really looking for. I think that BMW's interiors are too plain in comparison to Audi's.

Hi Mediaboy, thanks for your comments.

RGBAgree, thanks for your comments. I've read a couple of threads and I get the feeling you're a hardcore Audi Quattro fan. For now I think I will have to see it as the next step as I really want the optional extras. Hopefully I won't regret it.

 

If you have money to burn get AWD that you don't really need.
If you have money to burn get 3.0 that on UK roads you don't really need.
If you have money to burn get flappy paddles that are no use at low speeds. Most 'drivers' prefer manual (stick shift).

I've tested each and every combination for some days, not a short test drive.

I'm not suggesting AWD is only used in snow - that would be daft. However, when answering a point about AWD being safer in snow/ice (which I was in response to previous posts) then winter tyres are better and safer.

 

But it's not about "money to burn" though is it... I think that's a pretty bad attitude to take when spending £35k+ on a car in general. By that logic you're buying an A5 because you were looking at an A4 but had money to burn...

I don't mean to be confrontational as I'm not one for arguments but I really think that is a terrible attitude to take in my honest opinion. Value for money is totally in the heart and mind of the individual. I for one have been absolutely besotted with the A5's design since it was launched, and since I've owned the FWD 2.0TDI I've become hungry for a little more power. That power needs Quattro to hold the car down when I play. I work from home, and often leave the house at 2,3,4am just to take a drive on the empty roads. I know its an extreme, but I'm not the only one.

I can even see your point that Quattro and the V6 are expensive options that some people might not notice (let alone benefit from or even enjoy)... but to say that it's "burning money" is a very bold statement. For some, just knowing that their car is a cut above is worth the cost. There are so many personal circumstances that it is impossible to say what is value for money overall with these particular options.

I'm sure no one will argue with you that (in your opinion) those options are like burning money, but that is an opinion based on the way that you enjoy your car and shouldn't be touted as facts =/

Sorry, rant over.

 

I bought Quattro because I use its advantages daily, wet, dry, snow whatever.. Wet roundabouts are a favorite.

I bought V8 because I use the power and enjoy the sound daily, I have Nav and B&O yet rarely have them on.. It does not matter where your going in an S5...

I bought a 3.0 Tdi Avant Quattro as my dog likes to get where it's going with an owner that likes the above but not not in his S5 due to muddy paws...

Perhaps I do have money to burn, but I'd say, it's more about getting what works for you... And the above does for me.. Enjoy your toys... especially the next time your dusted by a 3.0lt Quattro

 

If I had a PP and was short of cash I would sell that and put towards Quattro !

 

As soon as I saw this thread pop up I knew it would turn out this way. It's like asking a parent which of his two children he prefers!

For me it was a no brainer. I do a lot of London driving and could not imagine doing it without the MMI system, and a few other toys, for the cost of Quattro. I went for the A5 over BMW and Merc as I wanted a change and I saw it as as best looking, well built GT car in my price range.

Did I just choose my boy or girl I'm all confused...!

 

The one thing that separates Audi from the other masses is the Quattro. It is recognised as a superior permanent 4 wheel drive system.

If you take away the Quattro, the car is just another VAG car, comparable to all their other brands which cost a lot less money for the same basic hardware, often coming from the same factory.

Even non-VAG cars, such as those with a three lettered logo or three pointed star logo on the front, obtain many of their components from the same place.

Quattro is different, its what makes the Audi different (when fitted) and whilst it is pointless in some cases, you certainly can feel a difference in handling even in perfect weather, dry roads, and perfect tyres, if you are looking for it. Most drivers just put the foot down and move forward letting the car do its job, but enthusiasts look for these things.

My vote is for Quattro every time. If I could not afford Quattro, I would buy another VAG branded car, get almost exactly the same car as the equivalent two wheel drive Audi, and save a huge difference in price. Those Audi badges are very expensive to manufacture and add a huge cost to the price....!

 

Hi Sameila, as a former A5 quattro owner I like to drop in to forum from time to time. It's still a great forum with lots of useful help and support.

I owned a " quattro " for 3 years. Was a great car inside and out. The quattro system definitely got me out of trouble in snow on a couple of occasions. Having said that however I think that quattro is largely a gimmick and that the vast majority of drivers couldn't tell the difference between a FWD car and a 4WD car 99% of the time ( and I include myself in that ). Most " enthusiasts " don't choose to drive 4WD cars, they are more likely to drive RWD cars because of the feedback and driver involvement which unfortunately is sadly lacking in 4WD cars.

At the end of the day it's your money. As Mulski says above you should really try to get a much longer test drive before committing to a £40k spend. Whatever you decide good luck and I'm sure you'll enjoy your A5 either way.

 

Right...my two peneth worth.

I've got a 2.0L TDI FWD. I had to have FWD as my budget (dictated by my MD at the time) wouldn't stretch to having quattro over the tech pack high that I use daily and the comms pack high I need daily.

Two points if I may...

1. FWD is good on very dry roads, Its pretty twitchy when accelerating while steering (pulling left onto a roundabout you can really feel the power going through the front wheels through your steering wheel). Overall its a nice ride.

2. The 2.0L has no guts at all in gears 1 and 2. All the rest from 3 to 6 have torque, power and speed in spades. Having said that I'm not a quick driver, and motorway/high speed driving is very quiet, comfortable and economical.

If I could do it all again with the budget I had...I'd stick with 2.0L TDI, but I'd sell my soul for the quattro (I've only got another 2.5 yrs to change!)

 

I came from a BMW 325ci and Z4 2.5 to my A5 2.0TDI FWD and can not stress how much I regret switching to a FWD car.

At the time I was on the absolute limit of my budget and could not afford to upgrade to Quattro but if I'd known what I do now I would never have bought an Audi without it. Ultimately for the first time in my life I went with the more toys/higher spec option over the better drivetrain and as nice as all these things are they never really make up for the let down of how the car drives when you push it.

Even with performance tyres it is surprisingly easy to break traction in the dry but near impossible not to in the wet if you accelerate relatively hard (inc. in gear). I only have the 2.0 so I dread to think what a 3.0 would be like when you are trying to put all that power down.

It really depends how you drive but if you are looking for a drivers car and like to drive enthusiastically then a FWD A5 will leave you disappointed especially coming from BMW (you don't really appreciate how good they are until you switch to something else).

It's maybe worth trying to get an extended test drive off of the dealer for perhaps a weekend to really see what it's like to have the A5 in that spec and if it suits your needs.

 

Quattro - relevant technology or marketing ploy?

I remembered that this was covered extensively some time ago in this thread: http://www.a5oc.com/forums/audi-lounge/8659-quattro-relevant-technology-marketing.html, from two and a half years back.

Posting as my alter-ego, I made the following point, which I completely stand by, particularly the penultimate paragraph (that means the one before the last one, RGB).

"Some of the most respected drivers' cars currently/recently available offer either front-wheel (Focus ST/RS, Megane 26R, VW Golf, Mondeo, Mini) or rear wheel (BMW 1/3/5 series, Merc SLK & AMG derivatives, Nissan 370, Astons, Ferraris, Maseratis, etc) drive and constantly receive plaudits from knowledgeable quarters. Last year, Alfa began offering a fwd version of the previously 4WD 159 V6 in response to user demand, saving weight and sharpening-up the driving experience in the process (I drove both versions back to back a couple of weeks ago and without a doubt, the FWD car with trick Q2 diff was the more scintillating ride).

Clearly there’s a few AWD cars at the upper end of the market (Bentley Conti, Gallardo, GT-R, Porsche 911 etc – all of whom have a predominantly RWD range) and a few manufacturers pepper the upper-end of their saloon or coupe ranges with 4WD variants (Vauxhall Insignia, Alfa 159 as noted, Saab Turbo-X) and the WRC derivatives in the Evo X and Impreza.
But overall, the majority of manufacturers provide either RWD or FWD across the majority of models in their ranges - with the notable exception of Audi.

Is this purely a marketing-inspired USP? Are the benefits of Quattro really required in a 170 hp A3 diesel for example? Or even a 240hp 3.0 A5?

Sure, there’s benefits to 4wd in some conditions, and perhaps these are emphasised for cars with 300bhp plus, but there’s also a trade-off in terms of fuel economy, weight, purchase cost and finesse – rarely do 4WD derivatives of either RWD or FWD base cars score as highly for driving pleasure as the 2WD versions.

In my view, it’s a marketing-led ploy, albeit a successful one. I think to many Audi customers, ‘Quattro’ is a comfort blanket, a bit like putting their fog lights on in the rain. It undoubtedly has a bit of a cachet to it (‘It’s a Quattro, you know’) and that probably appeals to many buyers more than the driving experience. Let’s face it, for many years, Audis have not exactly been razor-sharp driving machines, and even today, the larger part of the range is made up of workaday vehicles that appeal to the market from a platform of prestige & quality rather than the provision of a rewarding or engaging driving experience.

Driving a 350hp S5, a number of times I wondered what it would be like with RWD, 150kg lighter, steerable with the right foot. Not a bad prospect. If such a car were an option to the Quattro version, would I choose it? Probably……. "

 

I remembered that this was covered extensively some time ago in this thread: http://www.a5oc.com/forums/audi-lounge/8659-quattro-relevant-technology-marketing.html, from two and a half years back.

Posting as my alter-ego (before I got banned), I made the following point, which I completely stand by, particularly the penultimate paragraph (that means the one before the last one, RGB).

No need to be rude.

Seriously not everyone will agree but I do believe that Quattro is far more than a marketing ploy even though it is still a fairly unique selling point in the market.

Cheers

:cheers:RG:cheers:

 

Whilst I respect all said, and don't disagree with it.. I think it's a romanticized view.. Not many folk steer their car with their right foot day to day.. I'm not sure that's a sensible practice on the public roads in any case.. despite various TV shows heavy encouragement of the masses. What I do know is, on a daily basis we come across a mixed bag of road conditions, is Quattro a comfort blanket, I'd agree yes, does it inspire confidence, again yes.. Can you push the limits closer to the edge, I say yes once more.. I'd go as far as to say, I owe my life to Audi tech where in my youth, enthusiasm out stripped the road conditions and my ability, the computer took over to save the day.. A couple of occasions springing to mind.. Does that buy my loyalty, indeed.. Did I learn from it, yes.. If in a rear wheel drive car, would I be here today, I don't think so.. I like the confidence day to day. If I light up my S5, can much keep up? You'd better be good, but nothing beats my tail happy kart for edgy driving.. Did I fall foul of great quattro marketing? Hannu Mikkola back in 1982 has allot to answer for....

 

Hannu Mikkola back in 1982 has allot to answer for....

indeed fond memories of the RAC rally :thumbsup:

 

Interesting thread this. I cannot comment as only driven Quattro audis but A friend recently brought a new 2.0t Quattro after having an a4 fwd for 5 years and says doesnt notice any difference at all which i struggle to understand! We also have a rwd car and even at 170bhp it is easy to get it to break loose let alone in a car above this! At the end of the day i guess its what appeals to you and what you want from it.

 

well this thread has polariized into the usual Quattro is must have/waste of money camps.

In absolute terms nobody is right/nobody is wrong
it is all down to preference, in this case toys vs quattro.

As a current quattro driver who has driven all sorts of stuff over the years, it is quite interesting to try to define what is so good about quattro.

I think it is fair to say that those who have not owned quattro are not able to fully comprehend and comment on its abilities. No offence meant but a fact nonetheless.
I would also be confident to say that the most difficult drivetrain change to make is RWD -> FWD


Maybe a way I can try to describe is that as a Quattro owner getting a FWD car for courtesy car during service, you instantly miss the ability to just hoof it whenever you want. Torque steer and T/C instantly leave you incredibly frustrated. "what the hell is the point of having 200BHP if the electronics constantly stop you using it" sort of thing. This also serves to show that quattro changes your driving style encouraging the boot it and grin style.

What I must emphasize is that Quattro is constantly a benefit and felt in daily driving, wet dry or whatever, giving a balance and security to the car that is not available otherwise.

I will also say that when combined with Dynamic steeering and Sports Diff is is transformed by a further order of magnitude delivering stunning neutrality and balance for road use. (do note I am observing road use, not track use where RWD throttle sensitivity comes into its own).

ANY A5 is an excellent car for which any of us should be proud to own irrespective of spec.

However Audi are masters of the art of subtlety.

Instant appeal usually leads to long term frustration.
Quiet competence lends itself to long term enjoyment.

The A5 is like a good wine, though like good wines it is always possible to pay a liitle more to get a fine wine.

respect to anyone that gets to the end of that lot :thumbsup: