[GregC247]

Hi Everyone,

I bought a 2013 1.8 tfsi A5 convertible a month ago privately.

I did my due diligence. The car had 64K miles on it and had a full Audi SH for most of its life and full independent SH in recent years. it had passed every MOT without a single advisory. Fly wheel and Belt was recently changed and it looked like money had been spent on the car as needed. The car was tatty though...I got the impression the last owner wasn't a car person and did nothing to the upkeep of the car until it was time to service and MOT etc. Anyway.....

After 3 days of ownership the oil light came on. Naturally my heart sank as I was nervy having just bought the car and knowing the of the potential problem. I added 0.5L of oil and tripped the odometer.

The oil light has come on again after 530 miles of driving.
It's worth noting that it's freezing outside and I've been heading to work at 6am when the car is iced up etc.

My question is....is this the dreaded oil consumption issue or potentially something else?
I bought a FL car deliberately to avoid this so are their cases of this happening on FL cars?

Thanks in advance,
Greg

 

[rackingman]

My beloved had a 2012 and 2016 cab in 1.8 flavour. Both on long life service intervals and neither used oil enough to trigger a warning. Or to visibly reduce oil level on the dipstick I fitted. Hardly conclusive I know, but I would be checking for leaks and getting my head round the overly complicated oil thingy before panicking. Or fit a dipstick.
Interesting that someone who ran a tatty car forked out for a Fly wheel and Belt at only 64k though...

 

[GregC247]

My beloved had a 2012 and 2016 cab in 1.8 flavour. Both on long life service intervals and neither used oil enough to trigger a warning. Or to visibly reduce oil level on the dipstick I fitted. Hardly conclusive I know, but I would be checking for leaks and getting my head round the overly complicated oil thingy before panicking. Or fit a dipstick.
Interesting that someone who ran a tatty car forked out for a Fly wheel and Belt at only 64k though...

Thanks for the reply mate,

OK so that's interesting. I had a mechanic look over it before purchase and he stated he couldn't see any oil leeks but seems like I need to take a closer look along this line of enquiry.

I'm not mechanically minded so haven't a clue as to what else would cause that level of oil loss?

I think I'll get on and order a dipstick this evening.

The car was cosmetically tatty and my gut instinct is they were the sort of couple (it was the wives car) who would just throw it at the dealer for all work annually and not look at anything themselves. I don't think they'd have scrimped on any work though as there's extensive receipts etc.....I also dont think they are/were hiding anything...but who knows.

Just a bit gutted as I spent months finding the 'right one' and hope i havent landed myself a dud.

Cheers

 

[smurkenstein]

That's a bit odd - I had to top mine up when I missed a service but it was an on screen message. These cars do burn oil but 530 mi for a top up seems a bit quick although 500 mL isn't that much. I think I'd top it up again, check the oil level is near the top using the display and see how it goes. You could talk to the dealer about an oil consumption test and try to find out when the car was built.

 

[SimonRoma]

I agree with the previous two replies. I too purchased an A5 that was totally neglected and I nursed her back to health, I had zero service history whereas you have alot of receipts. I would look to get the car back to standard by applying loads of TLC and changing all fluids and filters BEFORE I decide if she is a good purchase. My idea is that she is fine, your car is later than the heavy oil consumption model years. Find a good independent VAG specialist and see what he thinks.

 

[sayek]

forked out for a Fly wheel and Belt at only 64k though...

IMO that seems very low mileage to replace flywheel. I recently bought a 2009 2L TFSI with 88k on clock. Checked a few prior purchase and cars that mentioned clutch/flywheel replaced where well over 100k.

Was the car clocked or just driven badly to kill the flywheel?

 

[GregC247]

IMO that seems very low mileage to replace flywheel. I recently bought a 2009 2L TFSI with 88k on clock. Checked a few prior purchase and cars that mentioned clutch/flywheel replaced where well over 100k.

Was the car clocked or just driven badly to kill the flywheel?

All history (most of which Audi) is legit....I'd be completely shocked if I have this wrong. (famous last words) MOT history too.

2 previous owners both women. Genuinely don't doubt the history but the car was almost certainly driven badly by the last owner. (She was the wife and had a new scirocco...automatic funnily enough).

The alloys were curbed, lots of scuffs and the inside was a joke....it stunk of dog and had shit loads of scratches everywhere (genuinely never seen anything like that).

My concern is still the oil consumption. What else could it be?

Thanks

 

[sayek]

I have the well known troubled 2009 engine that drinks more oil than fuel. But once these engines are fixed people reporting they drink 1L every 2k to 4k miles depending on engine condition.

The consumption rate you described is typical of pre-2012 faulty engine. If it was burning that much oil you should have dirty exhaust tips.
But if it's leaking would fall on the plastic engine undertray. Its possible to remove these trays while on axle stands. I recently did oil change and its not difficult to reach all the screws to remove the tray.

I know what you going through. I have the troubled engine and last few months was biting my nails every time I checked the oil level. I have fitted a dipstick as backup.

 

[C4mby]

Is there some sort of PCV on these engines? Does a malfunctioning PCV cause excessive oil consumption?

I’ll have a look in Elsawin. What engine code do you have?

 

[GregC247]

I have the well known troubled 2009 engine that drinks more oil than fuel. But once these engines are fixed people reporting they drink 1L every 2k to 4k miles depending on engine condition.

The consumption rate you described is typical of pre-2012 faulty engine. If it was burning that much oil you should have dirty exhaust tips.
But if it's leaking would fall on the plastic engine undertray. Its possible to remove these trays while on axle stands. I recently did oil change and its not difficult to reach all the screws to remove the tray.

I know what you going through. I have the troubled engine and last few months was biting my nails every time I checked the oil level. I have fitted a dipstick as backup.

OK Great shout. I guess removing that tray is the first port of call then.

The car had a pre-inspection but 'testing for oil leaks' was literally a visual test as far as I'm aware. So perhaps any leaked oil pooling at the tray might have obscured that?......

I cant see excessive dirt on the exhaust tips tbh but would need to make a comparison on that to be sure

 

[GregC247]

Is there some sort of PCV on these engines? Does a malfunctioning PCV cause excessive oil consumption?

I’ll have a look in Elsawin. What engine code do you have?

Where can I find the engine code?

 

[sayek]

[/QUOTE]
The PCV issues were on Pre-2012 models. Your car should have the upgraded PCV but worth a replacing.

They cost about £75 at the dealers and easy DIY but if you not confident a mechanic won't charge more than 30min of his time.
The video will help

 

[GregC247]

The PCV issues were on Pre-2012 models. Your car should have the upgraded PCV but worth a replacing.

They cost about £75 at the dealers and easy DIY but if you not confident a mechanic won't charge more than 30min of his time.
The video will help

[/QUOTE]
Thanks mate.

Super grateful for your help and advice.

 

[savs]

Lets go back to the beginning a bit here:

• Does your A5 give you an oil measurement via MMI?
  • If yes, what does it read (how much oil remaining)?
• Have you got the dipstick now?
  • If yes, how much oil do you measure?

Get a baseline measurement first. Then top oil to max level. Then measure weekly to see drop.

• With the oil at max level (according to MMI and/ or dipstick) Note how many miles done between each measurement
• Keep measuring until oil level gets to min (on MMI and/ or dipstick)
  • This will show how many actual miles covered per 1l oil consumed
• If oil light comes on before you get to min oil level with weekly checks - check level and fill accordingly.
  • This will show if you consume more oil than can be measured at a weekly check.

Don't start throwing parts or start looking for issues yet. There may not be one! Lets see how long/ miles a measured litre of oil takes to consume.

 

[julianwhitta]

I’d be inclined to take sav’s suggestion one step further - drain whatever oil is in the engine completely, drop in a new oil filter and new drain plug, refill with oil (I think the 1.8 actually has a slightly higher capacity than the 2.0 - 4.7 litres sounds right, but if anyone can confirm that would be helpful), and use that as your baseline. Go from there.

 

[SimonRoma]

Yeah, we should try to avoid head bandages BEFORE we fall over. You may have a good car and engine and just "normal" oil consumption.

 

[GregC247]

Lets go back to the beginning a bit here:

• Does your A5 give you an oil measurement via MMI?
  • If yes, what does it read (how much oil remaining)?
• Have you got the dipstick now?
  • If yes, how much oil do you measure?

Get a baseline measurement first. Then top oil to max level. Then measure weekly to see drop.

• With the oil at max level (according to MMI and/ or dipstick) Note how many miles done between each measurement
• Keep measuring until oil level gets to min (on MMI and/ or dipstick)
  • This will show how many actual miles covered per 1l oil consumed
• If oil light comes on before you get to min oil level with weekly checks - check level and fill accordingly.
  • This will show if you consume more oil than can be measured at a weekly check.

Don't start throwing parts or start looking for issues yet. There may not be one! Lets see how long/ miles a measured litre of oil takes to consume.

Firstly, thanks for yours and everyone's reply. Very grateful.

OK, here's the running order from the start. (approx 3 weeks ago)

Bought car, drove him home and about etc and after approx 200 miles the oil light came on for the first time. (from the history i could see oil had been changed back in March 2020 which was 6k miles earlier....) naturally I was gutted to see the light come on but just hoped the light had come on as it had burnt 1L in the 6K miles it had been driven but had no way of knowing whether the owner had topped it up in between services etc...

....so I tripped the odometer and added 0.5L. The warning came on in the dash and the 'level', as displayed in the dash, did respond to the 0.5L added by taking the level half way up and clearing the warning. This said to me it was somewhat accurate (though I know not as useful as a dipstick, which I don't have)

....530 miles later the same warning in dash has come on....I've added an additionally 0.5L again and tripped it once more just as above.

Unless the meter is wrong is burning/losing oil at a concerning rate....if it were on the margins of acceptable usage I wouldn't be so concerned.

Incidentally, the ESC warning light has come on this evening....😤

 

[GregC247]

I’d be inclined to take sav’s suggestion one step further - drain whatever oil is in the engine completely, drop in a new oil filter and new drain plug, refill with oil (I think the 1.8 actually has a slightly higher capacity than the 2.0 - 4.7 litres sounds right, but if anyone can confirm that would be helpful), and use that as your baseline. Go from there.

Yeah this makes a lot of sense. I think I'll have a go at this at the weekend.

 

[savs]

Firstly, thanks for yours and everyone's reply. Very grateful.

OK, here's the running order from the start. (approx 3 weeks ago)

Bought car, drove him home and about etc and after approx 200 miles the oil light came on for the first time. (from the history i could see oil had been changed back in March 2020 which was 6k miles earlier....) naturally I was gutted to see the light come on but just hoped the light had come on as it had burnt 1L in the 6K miles it had been driven but had no way of knowing whether the owner had topped it up in between services etc...

....so I tripped the odometer and added 0.5L. The warning came on in the dash and the 'level', as displayed in the dash, did respond to the 0.5L added by taking the level half way up and clearing the warning. This said to me it was somewhat accurate (though I know not as useful as a dipstick, which I don't have)

....530 miles later the same warning in dash has come on....I've added an additionally 0.5L again and tripped it once more just as above.

Unless the meter is wrong is burning/losing oil at a concerning rate....if it were on the margins of acceptable usage I wouldn't be so concerned.

Incidentally, the ESC warning light has come on this evening....😤

Hey Greg

Good write up. Ok. At the moment i'm inclined to believe the MMI oil gauge as it did decrease when you consumed 0.5l of oil. And registered as topped up half way by adding 0.5l of oil.
Rough estimate is 1l of oil consumed every 1000 miles then.

Now..... is that ok, acceptable of bad? Our cars use fully synthetic oil (no mineral at all!). I use Castrol Edge as per book. And at aprx £15 per litre, topping up your car every 1000 miles (every other fuel fill up?) is expensive.

Audi oil consumption for 1.8 and 2.0l petrol's (going by engine, not vehicle model for this one). Check the handbook if possible. My handook for an A5 states:

• Depending on how you drive and the conditions in which the car is used, oil consumption can be up to 0.5ltr/ 1000km...
• Thats a "get out of jail" caveat Audi have given themselves...!
• So for you car this works out 1ltr of oil per 1600km. Just below the handook.

This concerned me enough to search the net and lo and behold, unfortunately, there are indeed many cases of 1.8 tfsi oil consumption threads across many forums.
Cuurently i've seen solutions as:

• Keep topping up oil, drive, and enjoy (i know - don't shoot me! I'm not happy with that one).
• PCV fix as you've got above. This may help - but wont be known until you've done it.
• And...... this one pains me to mention it......... an issue with piston rings. These require replacing. Defective ones (not sure if its a sizing issue) allow oil to leak around pistons, which gets burnt up but gives high oil consumption. Not sure what long term effect this has on CAT. But keep topping up oil.
  • I suspect the previous owner just lived with the oil consumption and topped up.
• What is the exhaust like? Do you get smoke?
  • Blue = oil burning
  • White = coolant
    • If small amount of oil (although continuous hence consumption) this may not show at all

Now, before you throw the car in a river or off a cliff or..... through the home of the last owner! Have a good look on the internet (i have a feeling you already have).
This thread from piston heads for example has good view points: TFSI oil consumption fault - affected models? - Page 1 - Audi, VW, Seat & Skoda - PistonHeads UK

To quote a segment: "changed the oil breather pipe and a seal. Apparently the old parts where sucking up too much oil so they were replaced with different parts. If this didn't work the next step would have been to open up the engine. Luckily it did and the car now uses much less, about 1 litre every 3000 miles. "

I really wish i could be more help with this one. Sorry! Options are do the PCV fix and see how it goes. Or maybe go to Audi and see if there is a recall that relates to this issue?
I'm hoping someone can jump in a say they had it, and solved it. You my need to check different forums (the 1.8 tfsi used on VW, or other Audis etc).
It still may not necessarily be a bad thing (apart from in the pocket!), but i don't think its a good thing either?

 

[sayek]

@savs
I am a bit confused as the OP has a 2013 TFSI engine and these are the upgraded engines. The faulty engines that consumed oil were only 2008 to 2011.
Audi are still offering these repairs if you unucky enough to own one.
My work collegue has a 2010 TFSI from new with Audi service and they doing the repairs free. Some members here mentioned they had no Audi service history but Audi repaired the engine if owner made 10% contribution.

These faulty engines had 3 stage repairs.
Stage 1..upgrade the PCV
Stage 2..upgrade piston and rings
Stage 3..complete engine replace.

I bought a scary 2009 model in Oct. Done a oil change and been monitoring nervously. So far done about 550miles due to lockdown and its been stable 1 bar below the max for last 400 miles. From what I googled as I am in same boat, after the engine repaired owners reporting comsumption between 2k to 4k between topup.

Before the repair it was only couple hundred miles

Audi 2.0 TFSI Engine Oil Consumption - Correction

What is the problem? The early version of the TFSI gasoline engines found in the A5, A4 and Q5 have an inherent design fault which leads to high consumption of oil. The base problem seems to relate to the piston rings, which allow small amounts of oil to leak round

casestudies.atlanticmotorcar.com