[Europa]

I can't really say whether or not it's acceptable to have delays due to parts shortages. Knowing what I do about the car - that it's a low-volume, specialty car in its first year of production, it's unsurprising that a) the parts support network isn't running smoothly yet; and b) most technicians and their parts departments haven't a clue what to expect with these cars, so diagnosis isn't always going to be straightforward (even though *I believe* each dealership was required to send a tech to S5 repair training). Bear in mind that the MLP cars use the fancy new front differential for quattro, which necessitates some crazy configuration of two clutches and flywheels (or something like that), so it's not like your standard Audi.

Three weeks... ugh. I hope it doesn't take them that long for mine, but I'll survive... the TT is still a blast to drive.

 

[Seamo]

I can't really say whether or not it's acceptable to have delays due to parts shortages. Knowing what I do about the car - that it's a low-volume, specialty car in its first year of production, it's unsurprising that a) the parts support network isn't running smoothly yet; and b) most technicians and their parts departments haven't a clue what to expect with these cars, so diagnosis isn't always going to be straightforward (even though *I believe* each dealership was required to send a tech to S5 repair training). Bear in mind that the MLP cars use the fancy new front differential for quattro, which necessitates some crazy configuration of two clutches and flywheels (or something like that), so it's not like your standard Audi.

Three weeks... ugh. I hope it doesn't take them that long for mine, but I'll survive... the TT is still a blast to drive.

Good points. I got an a4 1.8T - not bad.

 

[waiting4myS5]

Sorry, I am kinda late to this post:

I looked for it 2 weeks ago, but for some reason didn't see it.

I assume the clutch issue being described here is EXACTLY what my new, 3-week-old S5 is experiencing (and has been since the end of week 1).

I describe it as "gritty." When you press down on the clutch it feels like there is sand in the movement and when you release it (especially noticable if releasing slowly) it gets "stuck" momentarilly here and there making it hard to shift smoothly as your foot actually comes off the pedal for an instant until the pedal catches up to your foot.

I took the car into the service center - on my way there, if course, it was not happening. My service manager took it for a test ride and did not feel it. When I left, I got to the first traffic light and the problem came back. I went around the block, back to the dealer and this time the Service manager got to feel it.

He suggested that it needed to be "bled" - HA!
He then had one of his mechanics get int he car and just depress the clutch.. the mechanic immediately said - "It feels like a throw-out bearing."

Long story short, the told me that the transmission will have to come out for the repair - it will take at least a week - and they couldn't schedule me until June 24. (I brought the car in to them on June 12.) Though service manager suggested driving it would not be a problem, the mechanic told me that if I didn't have to drive it - DON'T! I assume this is because you never know when it might stop working all together.

So my brand new S5 has been sitting in the driveway for about 2 weeks now - it goes in this upcoming week and so that will be at least another week or 2 until it is drivable again. You can imagine how happy I am.

I just wrote an email to Audi... they called the next day surprised that I am having this problem. We will see how it turns out.

Judging from this post, I am not the only person having this problem. Based on what the service center told me - if you have the "gritty clutch" take it in to the dealer - do not keep driving it cause you might end up stranded somewhere.

J

P.S. I did notice that when the car has been sitting for a day or so - the first few minutes of driving feels fine - the clutch begins to feel gritty after a short while.

 

[SDS5]

Clutch repairs - let's get wise first.

Sorry, I am kinda late to this post:

I assume the clutch issue being described here is EXACTLY what my new, 3-week-old S5 is experiencing (and has been since the end of week 1).

I describe it as "gritty." When you press down on the clutch it feels like there is sand in the movement and when you release it (especially noticable if releasing slowly) it gets "stuck" momentarilly here and there making it hard to shift smoothly as your foot actually comes off the pedal for an instant until the pedal catches up to your foot.

Sorry to hear about your clutch. I think a number of members are having similar issues. For me,the pedal releases smoothly, but I can feel a vibration while shifting at high RPM (>4000rpm). To be honest, I dont know if this is normal or not, but I think not.

Based upon a post on Audiworld, approx 1500 faulty release bearings made it past Audi's quality control - so many more members cars could have this latent defect, which would show up later.

I am particularly outraged that my S5 will probably need to have its Engine /transmission removed so early in its life. We can scream all we like, but if the bearing is faulty, then it have to be replaced - no option there.

What worries me more, is many bad experiences with dealer tech's here in the USA. Getting someone well qualified to do the job AND take the care in diassembling and assembling things correctly. Now since the S5 is a new transmission type and new body, this is my checklist before I will let anyone work on my S5;

a) has the tech been trained specifically to work on an the A5/S5 8T platform?
b) physically show me all the special tools athat are required to do this job - those are the tools that the manual says that will be needed. (I will post this later)
c) If there is a part number change due to a design flaw, then let's have that fully explained also - preferrably via a TSB from Audi.

d) lastly I would take pictures of the underside and interior so that when the car comes back damaged you have evidence that the dealer did it and it will be fixed.

Sounds harsh - its just based upon my experiences and that of others that I know.

My feeling is that if enough members are affected we could jointly write to AoA expressing our concerns and seeking assurance that ONLY qualified tech WITH the correct tools perform this outrageous repair.

Members feel free to chime in.

 

[Europa]

SDS5: You describe this issue as "...outrageous... " - I think this characterization is grossly unreasonable. Cars are imperfect machines, and things necessarily do go wrong (even in $60K cars). It’s also worth noting that the S5 is in its FIRST model year, which is typically a period in which there are many growing pains. I knew I was bearing some risk in buying a first model year car on an entirely new platform. If this is the only widespread problem, I say congrats to Audi on a job well done. From the outside, this sounds to me like a bad batch of bearings from Audi's bearing supplier, not some systemic engineering flaw on Audi's part. Don't you think that the S5 underwent hundreds of thousands of miles of shakedown testing, and that they would have caught and fixed this if it was either a design flaw or that there were inadequate specs on the bearing that were causing premature wear or failure? I think so. If it is an overall engineering flaw, as evidenced by repeated failures in repaired cars, well, then we can start tossing around words like "outrageous."

I share your hesitation about having your (my) car be the first car torn apart for a transmission R&R, but this is where trust with the dealership comes in. I do know for a fact that they have a tech who went to S5 training, and I am confident that this tech will be the one working on my car. I'm not crazy about my car being the one he learns on, but that's life. Yes, the crank-diff-flywheel-clutch arrangement is unique to this car, but I feel like this will only enhance the diligence with which the tech will perform the repair. I'd also like to see the TSB, if it exists at the time, but I'm not going to pound the table for it.

"b) physically show me all the special tools that are required to do this job - those are the tools that the manual says that will be needed." Come on, you can't be serious... that is such an unrealistic demand. If I were a dealership, I'd ask you to go elsewhere because it sounds like you'd be the type of person who would be impossible to satisfy. Note also that this repair does not require removal of the engine.

I know your post was intended to be constructive and helpful, but I really think you have some unrealistic expectations about this situation. It's fine to be insistent that the dealer act with extra care and diligence in doing this repair, but you need to temper your expectations with a little easiness.

 

[SDS5]

Audi Quality Control

Hi Europa,

Well, we all have our perceptions and reasons for them.

I have owned Audi and VW since 1981. I like them because of their design, and yes Audi do go through extensive testing to validate the design - no dispute there.

However, my point is not about design per se. Its about Quality Control. A release bearing should last 100k miles+ or the life of the car. What we appear to have here is a part failing within less than 50 hours of operation.

This is not a subtle fault - I felt slight peddle rumble when I picked up the car. Others have had stickiness in the clutch pedal from the delivery day!

How did this kind of thing get past all stages of manufacture and test?

The fact that the bearing or release mechanism is rough should have been detected during assembly at the factory, or it should have been noticed by the techs that do the track test drive on each A5/S5 as the final Quality check prior to shipment from Germany, or at the very least.... the last in the chain - the tech at the Audi Dealer doing the pre-delivery inspection!

I am embarrased to tell my friends that my $63k car has to have a new release bearing at just 4,000 miles. This type of issue is outrageous! in my opinion. I will hold out until Audi tech's here have practised a few times on other A5/S5's.

Then there are other issues with A5/S5 Quality Control (not design) that are worth mentioing;

- the seat leather stiching/padding is failing on some cars requiring some seats to be replaced (equally outrageous, IMHO),

- one Audiworld member had a heater core fail and the whole dashboard had to be removed!

- Wheel vibration for some members - from new!

- Some LED's in the DRL assembly are failing.

-others have noticed more minor things such as the print rubbing off the start/stop button.

The clutch release bearing (if it turns out to be that) is just another example of poor quality control.

The bearing issue for me is a particularly annoying one - I purchased a 2004 Passat Wagon from new - in the first 15,000 miles the front nearside bearing failed. Before 50,000 miles were out, two more had failed. Maybe VW/Audi should change the bearing supplier or do 100% inspection on all critical bearings before assembly.

Don't mis-understand me.... I love everything about Audi's - the design, the technology, style and so on - its just that I don't buy the excuse that because the model is new, we should accept poor quality control as well - these are two different issues.

respectfully,

SDS5

 

[waiting4myS5]

I am in agreement on both sides... On one hand, everyone I know at some point expressed concern about my purchasing a first-year production model... Of course there are potential "kinks" that may need to be ironed out.

However, I also feel that since this is not a $300 iPhone, it is a $60K+ car that should be reliable and safe, every potential flaw should have been thoroughly sorted out prior to selling the machine. If this was one, isolated incident, then I would chalk it up to a random bad part - I understand that these things happen - but seeing here that is it more widespread than just my car, I can't help but think that this should have been worked out. (Though I will admit, I do feel better that it is not just my bad luck.)

All in all, I do not think that Audi / VW should be burned at the stake, I do however, feel that the company has an obligation to do absolutely everything with their power to ensure that the problem is rectified and that us owners are compensated properly

How? I am not sure... extending the warranty on the tranny? giving me 3/4 of a month off my payments? - I know that's not happening.... extending my 90-day Satellite radio subscription by 3 or 4 weeks that I won't be driving my car? (Anyone else find it odd that a $15k GM comes with a whole year's worth and a $60K Audi only comes with 90-days? - oh well) How about at the very least a guarantee that the job will be done correctly and that I will have no other problems relating to this with my car?

That is what worries me the most, actually - my whole life, I have always heard people say "once the transmission is taken out of a car, it never drives the same." I hope that is just a cliche.

For the record, I purchased a smart fortwo back in February - 3rd delivery from the dealer - I have had no problems at all with that car. Also, in 2002 when I leased an Audi A4, it was the first year of the new design - also, a virtually flawless car for the 3 years that I had it. - The bearing issue is probably just a fluke... like I said, I just hope they do the right thing.

J

 

[wsherring]

First Model Year

"I knew I was bearing some risk in buying a first model year car on an entirely new platform"

Wasn't the S5 already out in Europe for the 2007 model year? That would mean it's in it's second year now.

 

[Europa]

Nominally, there may be two model years, but speaking practially, the S5/A5 was in production for less than a full year by the time I got my car in October. It is still reasonable to call it "first model year."

 

[Seamo]

Car has been put back together and was taken on a short test drive today. Dealer says, so far so good, however, it will get about 20 miles tonight and tomorrow which should give a better indication.

 

[Europa]

SDS5:

I still don't see anything with these cars yet that rises to the level of outrageous. Again, if it were some systemic failure in engineering or quality control, then I'd agree (the paint orangepeel effect irks me). But I really don't think this is an easy QC catch - many of the cars may not have exhibited symptoms until they had some miles on them.

I respect your experience with Audi; my experience with the S5, the TT, and the A4 has been excellent. The dying radio situation on the A4 is outrageous, as is the cluster situation on the TT, but otherwise, they've been reliable and dependable.

 

[Seamo]

Latest news is that the car needs a gear recognition switch which is on back order. Apparently it affects the brake, hill-hold and possibly the anti-stall. I want my car back - 4 weeks next Monday

 

[albinorhino]

My clutch seems fine but especially in 1st and 2nd gears when I accelerate smoothly and gradually there is a feeling of resistance at around 2500rpms. Not there on rapid takeoffs or in the higher gears. Is this normal for an S5 since I have never felt it in my other cars?

 

[number2jcb]

Shame you guys are having clutch issues. I figured with an early demo model that I would have the problem too, but I have no issues at all. Hope that your dealers and Audi take care of you right.

 

[SFW]

My S5 is a '09 model end it also has that pedal stickiness ...

Anyone fixed this problem yet?

 

[waiting4myS5]

At service ctr for nearly 2 weeks - no word

I brought my car in to service on June 24. I haven't heard a word from them since. It's now nearly 4 weeks since I've been able to drive my S5. I'm kinda unhappy about the situation.

I did, however happen to mention to the phone survey people the fact that my car did not come with a full tank of gas... I've gotten 4 (yes 4) phone calls from Audi and my dealer about that! The fact that my car is sitting in the bowels of the service center with a mfg. defect, however. . . they're going to "look into it."

 

[Seamo]

I brought my car in to service on June 24. I haven't heard a word from them since. It's now nearly 4 weeks since I've been able to drive my S5. I'm kinda unhappy about the situation.

I did, however happen to mention to the phone survey people the fact that my car did not come with a full tank of gas... I've gotten 4 (yes 4) phone calls from Audi and my dealer about that! The fact that my car is sitting in the bowels of the service center with a mfg. defect, however. . . they're going to "look into it."

I got my car back after 4 weeks and 2 days. The whole clutch was replaced.
Seems fine and I will write a line once I have put a few miles up.

 

[Seamo]

I got my car back after 4 weeks and 2 days. The whole clutch was replaced.
Seems fine and I will write a line once I have put a few miles up.

Have about 100 miles on the new clutch and I have started to feel the grinding again

It is really beyond belief...........................

 

[waiting4myS5]

Update - not much of an update :-(

Seamo - this is NOT good news - I am sorry to hear this! It feels like the SAME grinding sensation that you felt the first time?

After placing 4 phone calls and sending 1 email to my Service Manager (before I bash the dealer / service center, I had an '02 A4 from this dealer and was very happy at that time) I FINALLY got a call back. (2 weeks and 1 day since I gave them my brand new car.)

This is what I was told... "The transmission has been taking out of the car." "The bearing they ordered from the catalog was the wrong one - turns out that the right one is not even in the catalog." "The correct bearing has been ordered from Audi in Germany to be sent out red label." "This means that they will do whatever possible - no expense spared (this is how it was phrased) - to get the part here as soon as possible, but it is coming from Germany so we do not know how long this will take."

So really my status update didn't tell me much. My service manager did add, that they saw some "hot spots" on the flywheel and clutch (I am not sure exactly what this means) and so they are "just going to replace the whole thing and make it right."

I understand that this is a new model and parts take time and what not (ok - I must throw in that the car has been "out" since September - no real reason some of these parts couldn't have made it here by now) but this is still not fair that I gave them my money when it was due, but I can't drive my car yet - I wonder what, if anything, will be done.

Seamo - I am, again, sorry for you and suddenly not confident about my S5's future. I don't know where you are but here in NY (i believe it is a state thing), Lemon Law states that a major problem that has to be fixed 3 times warrants a complete replacement of the vehicle. (Not sure of the exact stipulations there, but I do know a good friend that had her Mini Cooper replace a few years ago after several MAJOR problems that kept coming back).

J

 

[Seamo]

Seamo - this is NOT good news - I am sorry to hear this! It feels like the SAME grinding sensation that you felt the first time?

After placing 4 phone calls and sending 1 email to my Service Manager (before I bash the dealer / service center, I had an '02 A4 from this dealer and was very happy at that time) I FINALLY got a call back. (2 weeks and 1 day since I gave them my brand new car.)

This is what I was told... "The transmission has been taking out of the car." "The bearing they ordered from the catalog was the wrong one - turns out that the right one is not even in the catalog." "The correct bearing has been ordered from Audi in Germany to be sent out red label." "This means that they will do whatever possible - no expense spared (this is how it was phrased) - to get the part here as soon as possible, but it is coming from Germany so we do not know how long this will take."

So really my status update didn't tell me much. My service manager did add, that they saw some "hot spots" on the flywheel and clutch (I am not sure exactly what this means) and so they are "just going to replace the whole thing and make it right."

I understand that this is a new model and parts take time and what not (ok - I must throw in that the car has been "out" since September - no real reason some of these parts couldn't have made it here by now) but this is still not fair that I gave them my money when it was due, but I can't drive my car yet - I wonder what, if anything, will be done.

Seamo - I am, again, sorry for you and suddenly not confident about my S5's future. I don't know where you are but here in NY (i believe it is a state thing), Lemon Law states that a major problem that has to be fixed 3 times warrants a complete replacement of the vehicle. (Not sure of the exact stipulations there, but I do know a good friend that had her Mini Cooper replace a few years ago after several MAJOR problems that kept coming back).

J

Thanks J, really appreciate your news and good wishes.
I will let you know how it goes after I speak with the Sales Manager and the Service guys.