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Discussion Starter #1
I know there are a lot of threads about the consumption issue but the information is all rather murky and extracting useful information is a little futile.
Can I have your assistance please to collate some info?

*Stage 2 = new pistons

I would like to know...

1) Engine type | what is the engine code? (e.g.CAEB)
2) Mileage that stage 2* was performed
3) Month / year of fix
4) Approximate average oil consumption before fix (miles per litre)
5) Do you have an engine remap before / after?
6) Was it under an Audi warranty?
7) Did you go direct to a dealer or created a case with AudiUK / AoA etc
8) What is your current oil level % and mileage since the fix



e.g.

1) CAEB
2) 63k miles
3) Oct '14
4) 700 miles
5) no
6) no
7) 90% 3000 miles
7) AudiUK
 

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SCainER I have posted a few points up in regards to this issue over the last week and can elaborate if required but the news is I have gone from Audi UK paying for replacement Pistons etc to now requiring a Full engine replacement which after two days of arguing they are paying for it all over £10k worth...

A. Unfortunately I don't have any paperwork with me?
B. 69,900
C. Now completion date Monday 30
D. Burning a litre every 250 miles
E. No remap
F. Out of warranty but does have full dealer service history
G. Flagged it up through my local dealership Inchcape Audi Swindon, they then approached Audi UK, until I was informed that it now required a new engine so we both went on the offensive direct to Audi Uk... The POC wouldn't or wasn't available to discuss the matter every time time I phoned however within 3 days an agreement was raised 90% paid by Audi UK and 10% by Audi Swindon..
H. Hopefully won't bother me....

I was told that it was taking so long as Audi UK where making decisions that could affect the A5 2.0T range - I was told that the UK and Europe doesn't have a recall in place unlike Canada, Australia and US due to the majority of the vehicles here being deisel engines...
 

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Since buying my 2009 2.0TFSI 3 weeks ago I've been monitoring my oil gauge after reading on forums about this issue. I've almost done 1,000 miles and the MMI reading is still at max so I'm hoping mine is ok. The engine code is CDNB, does anyone know what the difference is between this and CAEB? I searched google but nothing useful came up...
 

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Discussion Starter #4 (Edited)
177 bhp = CAEA/CDNB
208 bhp = CAEA/CAEB/CDNC

I've also can't find the differences.

All seem to be in production at the same times, so I can only assume it relates to the plant it was produced in rather than a revision.
 

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Ah, that makes sense. I'm planning to remap with Bluefin but worried this may cause oil issues. As far as I've researched, the difference between the 180 and 210bhp A5 is down to the ECU rather than any physical components but having different engine codes suggests that there may be differences...
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I think the engine plant theory is busted as the A4, A5 and Q5 all come from Ingolstadt, Germany. Although it is possible that the US engines came from China making it the only difference I can see.

Theory 2 - The differences could be based upon the fuel quality of the intended region. So there could be subtle differences to the engine components, with certain engines going to certain markets.


From what I have read,
PCV valve failure introduces oil to be burned creating carbon deposits
The carbon deposits build up and block oil drainage flow under the piston.
This increases the oil pressure during ignition.
This pressure / carbon eventually forces the piston rings to seep oil
This increases the carbon / oil usage (vicious cycle starts)
This cycle can make the oil ineffective damaging the engine block

Originally when pistons were replaced it was likely with the same type of pistons. This means that the PCV valve should be replaced like spark plugs as part of a maintenance schedule.
I believe the pistons they are fitting now have a thicker ring.


Recommendations (but just an opinion):
Replace PCV valve every 20k or 3 years
Only use V power, Don't use momentum (tested to produce more carbon than V power)
 

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Have not got the oil burn problem - goes from service to service on max. In case it helps millage is 45,000 and CDNC engine. When warmed up drive it "enthusiastically" and hope this will stop the dreaded carbon build up. Am looking for anyone in the North cambs/ south lincs area who has done the valve clean for names, numbers etc.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
It is interesting to see that the same engine has 45k miles without an issue. If it is the same components then the only other factors are driving/journey type and fuel type.
 

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1) 2.0TFSI, Engine Code CDN (not sure if thats right?)
2) 25,000 miles
3) 08/2013
4) Ah...sorry can't remember. But below the Audi specification
5) No remap
6) Yes
7) Direct to dealer
8) Have had to top up oil 3 times since the fix in between oil change services. Have decided to monitor the exact mileage as of today. Topped up exactly 1 litre (oil light came on) at 45670, and will record mileage until light comes on again. Spoke to Audi and said if the parts are at fault, they will redo the work under the 2-year parts warranty that comes as standard. If more work is needed, would discuss with Audi UK.

If i don't top up under 600 miles (which I doubt I will as it hasn't been very regular and I do that in 2 weeks easily) i doubt Audi will take notice.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
DrEskimo, that roughly works out at about 12k miles a year.
Assuming you had a service 08/2014 and consumption is consistent that works out at 4000 miles a litre.
e.g.
25,000 miles 100% oil (08/13)
29,000 needs 1 litre (12/13)
33,000 needs 1 litre (04/14)
37,000 service 100% oil (08/14)
41,000 needs 1 litre (12/14)
45,000 needs 1 litre (04/15)


What fuel has mainly been used in the car? (regular / premium)
What is the daily commute like? (20 minutes urban with traffic lights, 5 minutes national speed limit)
How regularly do you WOT the engine?
 

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Yup pretty spot on SCainEr.

Had a oil service at 32,000 and 41,000 so had to do a oil change each side of those (29k, 37k & 45k miles).

Fuel - Always regular. Fuel costs enough as it is...

Commute is 95% motorway. 5 mins town driving, 15-25mins motorway

WOT = Wide open Throttle? If so, quite rare. Mostly stick it on cruise control at 75mph.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Your 4-5k miles a litre will definitely be within spec, but I guess it could drop off at any time if the issue returns.
You also use fuel with minimum additives and generally driving without using the engines potential.
I know the Italian tune-ups is old-skool but I still think allowing the engine to work hard and hot on occasion is the best way to burn the crap it creates. Its just an opinion based upon what i've read.



Regarding the fuel... here is some info to think about (results from a 2.0 TFSI Audi TT)

Fuel A = Regular Shell - 9.148 l/100km
Fuel B = Regular Tesco - 9.005 l/100km (-1.57% from A)
Fuel C = Momentum - 8.884 l/100km (-1.34 from B)
Fuel D = VPover - 8.587 l/100km (-3.35% from C)

Premium fuel is 5p extra a litre for momentum, 8p for V power


A) 1,000 miles = 1,600km = 146.368 litres @ 1.12 = £163.93
B) 1,000 miles = 1,600km = 144.080 litres @ 1.12 = £161.37
C) 1,000 miles = 1,600km = 142.144 litres @ 1.17 = £166.31
D) 1,000 miles = 1,600km = 137.392 litres @ 1.20 = £164.87

The extra cost is minimal, but the advantages of the premium fuel is better performance (higher octane), cleaning (additives) and protection (lubricate fuel system). As its a cleaner fuel it will also create less carbon deposits.

My preference is V Power as i've read things about smoke with Momentum, and their own report shows V Power reduced more carbon than their premium fuel. The people against V power are the ones that have read about the old aggressive formula that destroyed old engines.
 

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And driving style - i do a real mix of journey lengths, but do not let the car lag under 2000 revs - use mobil 1 oil and BP ultimate or shell vpower. I so wish they did not have the oil burner issue as I love the car and it stops people buying what is a great motor !
 

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Your 4-5k miles a litre will definitely be within spec, but I guess it could drop off at any time if the issue returns.

You also use fuel with minimum additives and generally driving without using the engines potential.

I know the Italian tune-ups is old-skool but I still think allowing the engine to work hard and hot on occasion is the best way to burn the crap it creates. Its just an opinion based upon what i've read.







Regarding the fuel... here is some info to think about (results from a 2.0 TFSI Audi TT)



Fuel A = Regular Shell - 9.148 l/100km

Fuel B = Regular Tesco - 9.005 l/100km (-1.57% from A)

Fuel C = Momentum - 8.884 l/100km (-1.34 from B)

Fuel D = VPover - 8.587 l/100km (-3.35% from C)



Premium fuel is 5p extra a litre for momentum, 8p for V power





A) 1,000 miles = 1,600km = 146.368 litres @ 1.12 = £163.93

B) 1,000 miles = 1,600km = 144.080 litres @ 1.12 = £161.37

C) 1,000 miles = 1,600km = 142.144 litres @ 1.17 = £166.31

D) 1,000 miles = 1,600km = 137.392 litres @ 1.20 = £164.87



The extra cost is minimal, but the advantages of the premium fuel is better performance (higher octane), cleaning (additives) and protection (lubricate fuel system). As its a cleaner fuel it will also create less carbon deposits.



My preference is V Power as i've read things about smoke with Momentum, and their own report shows V Power reduced more carbon than their premium fuel. The people against V power are the ones that have read about the old aggressive formula that destroyed old engines.

To be fair, all those figures tell me is that the MPG is marginally better for the premium fuel, but this is still not offset by the additional cost per litre.

Perhaps it's common knowledge, but the part I haven't been sold on are those claims on enhanced performance, cleaning and lubrication. What I can't seem to find is solid evidence suggesting that on standard car setups (such as my factory standard 2.0TFSI A5) it improves XYZ by a factor of X%. Admittedly my research is limited, but the science at best suggests very small gains unlikely to affect real world performance, and at worse, bold untestable claims that are never realised, sold through clever marketing...
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Okay the better performance part is misleading marketing hogwash. Essentially the higher octane allows for a better controlled ignition which in turn can be more efficient bringing performance closer to what it should get. In term of figures it can be up to 5% HP and torque variance between the fuels.

Fifth Gear did a report with a Golf GTI, showing about 5 hp, the most interesting part is where VBH mentions she felt a difference in acceleration (torque).
I myself had a Octavia VRS and at low revs with regular fuel the engine was less responsive. Vpower just made it easier to drive in traffic.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WTaBngvsPrc

Two things missing from the report.
1) Nothing about improved mileage which essentially absorbs the cost difference.
2) Nothing about benefits of the additives keeping things cleaner over a period of time. (I think Plato did another report with off the shelf additives showing it restored some performance)

A dirty engine loses performance and can cause future worries.
I just believe that if the higher octane and additives create a cleaner burn, then knowing the engine is prone to carbon issues why would anyone want to save a few £ a month, and risk issues down the road. This is just my opinion.
 

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Yea I remember watching that fifth gear report. Slightly annoyed she wasn't blinded to the fuel type when she drove it around the tracks! As you say, perhaps slight increases in BHP and torque, but not much above random error alone.

I guess the problem is that in the absence of the counter-factual, we will never know if a car does better using only premium fuel, compared to standard fuel. Obviously you can compare two identical spec cars using the two different fuels, but there are so many other factors that will inevitably impact their performance and reliability, it would be impossible to know the true effect of the fuel alone.

Having said all that, you do make a very valid point. If we know the long-term cost is negligible between the fuels, and there is a theoretical reason for the premium fuel to improve the carbon related issues, surely its worth it....

Certainly food for thought!
 

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Well this isn't a good sign. Done 139.1 miles and my MMI is already showing that I've used a quarter of my oil.....
 

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my Audi A5

My issue is that I've had my A5 for about 8 weeks and in that time I've purchased 5+ litres of oil, its really going through it, I took it to my local garage and he mentioned that theses model have an engine floor in that its been widely reported that i'm not the only person experiencing these issues,

I didn't purchase the car from Audi so I'm afraid that they are going to try and fob me off as you are aware a new engine on one of these babies is EXPENSIVE, has anyone else had a similar experience can you offer any tips on how I can get this issue sorted, at the end of the day surely this is an AUDI issue?

roy
 

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See the other parts of the site with reference to this - get all the details you can about the history and servicing and go to audi - note some dealers are shite at this and some are fantastic. Some guys on here with an incomplete audi service history have had the full engine replaced free. It is on pre facelift models with certain engine codes, audi has accepted some responsibility, was on watchdog and is really well known - some of the 2.0 petrol cars have it, some don't.
 
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