Oil Catch Can - UK Group Buy

[Spinner]

Hi all,

I suspect most of you have read the issues with carbon build up in the intake manifold on the FSI engines, if not see this thread. The belief is that an oil catch can will reduce this problem dramatically.

I have sourced a deal with Sanspeed in Bexleyheath for approx £180 (inc. installation) on a group buy .

Obviously if we get good numbers this will be lower, however if like myself you are concerned what this is potentially doing to your engine then IMO anything under £200 is a small price to pay.

Please register your interest here.

[tinaalia]

I'm in the US but im deff interested.

[zee007]

Any details on the catch can itself? Brand? Fabrication? Hoses? Custom fit? I'm interested too (obviously I'm Stateside) but some more details would be great please....

[Spinner]

Nothing specific, I'll request info.

[zee007]

Originally Posted by Spinner

Nothing specific, I'll request info.

Thanks bud - but do put me down as interested. Clearly, we'll have to figure out costs (as US guys won;t have it fitted there, but will need shipping costs)...

Thanks for organising this - it's needed...

[Spinner]

No probs Zee, this is not a specific system for the A/S5.

I was at Sanspeed looking into some of the Supercharger options last week and noticed a catch can in their shop so asked about the viability of getting it sorted. Therefore it definately be a custom fit but if there is a demand I'm sure Sanspeed will happily put together a kit that can be shipped.

[Chris_B]

Anyone think Audi UK would invalidate a warranty for this? Obviously, they shouldn't as it's a fix for their design flaw, but you know there's a risk of them using any excuse...

[Spinner]

To be honest I can't see why this concern over Audi UK warranty keeps cropping up for such obscure issues. I've had plenty modding done to my car and a few warranty replacements... door handles for keyless entry, vibration in passenger door and replacement drive pully that rusted. None of this has been a cause for concern by the dealer or Audi UK whatsoever. The passenger door vibration could easily have been related to my excessively loud exhaust but no problem at all and they ended up having it in for a total of 3 days to sound proof it. We've even had a forum member who had his ECU fried by a tuner, towed directly from the dyno centre by Audi (RAC) recovery to the dealer and they replaced it without question including loaning the owner a car until the part was in.

Saying that I understand if the problem could be more obviously related to a mod (i.e. suspension problem after having aftermarket coilovers installed). My advise as always regarding warranties is to (a) ensure you have a good relationship with a dealer, remember they are the ones that will put any warranty claim to Audi so if they feel obliged to look after you they will speak to Audi in a manner that favours you, (b) ensure you understand that there is an inheriant risk of voiding warranty for some linked components but understand those risks are limited to just the linked components.

So, in this instance I can see very little (if anything at all) that could be related back to having an oil catch can.

Funnily enough I spoke to the Service Manager at Audi Crawley yesterday and he confirmed the problem definately exists in the RS4 (they've replaced 2 blown engines ) but was unsure about the A/S5 as they've had none in for the problem so far. I explained I was planning to fit an oil catch can and he thought it was at worst a good protection for the engine.

Sorry for the rant and this isn't aimed specifically at you Chris_B, over the last 12 months UK warranties have become IMO a far bigger contentious issue on this forum than it ever needs to be

[specialized5223]

Pics of a catch can installed?

[Spinner]

Originally Posted by specialized5223

Pics of a catch can installed?

It hasn't been done yet.

[RS5ive]

Originally Posted by Spinner

We've even had a forum member who had his ECU fried by a tune....r

LOL - allegedly - gotta give them the benefit of the doubt as the car had in fact been persistently been refusing to start before then - maybe the dyno session just pushed it over the edge!

Originally Posted by Spinner

....towed directly from the dyno centre by Audi (RAC) recovery to the dealer and they replaced it without question including loaning the owner a car until the part was in.

Yeah, that was a bit of a relief.... Having said that though, it's wise to be relatively cautious with a modification that could be said to have a material effect on engine internals, as this clearly would. Agree that it's ironic that the mod is purely to offset an affliction created by Audi's own fair hand but even so, despite my historical successes, I wouldn't personally expect to be able to push through an engine-related warrantly claim with one of these fitted.

Must say, £200-odd is pretty inexpensive - but what about the £1000 or so to de-coke the engine in the first place? If a particular car had suffered excessive carbon build-up, and the catch-can was appiled as a measure to prevent further deterioration, wouldn't most people want to start with a clean sheet/inlet manifold?

Or does the application of the can offer retrospective cleaning benefit as well?

Perhaps Step 2 should be to organise a Group Buy for an engine strip-down & de-coke!

[Spinner]

Originally Posted by RS5ive

LOL - allegedly - gotta give them the benefit of the doubt as the car had in fact been persistently been refusing to start before then - maybe the dyno session just pushed it over the edge!

Ah now the full truth comes out, but no I'm not going to give the benefit of the doubt mate. You work within an industry so should knows full well computer chips dont work intermittently. Your ECU was fried mate, like you said at the time you got nothing, no MMI or anything, there's only one answer for that. Not knocking the tuner, shit happens and it only takes one bad luck case were wrong code or corrupted code hits the chips and it's all over.

Anyway point was that over the last year or so too much has been made of Audi Warranty being completely voided for the most irrelevant things, which IMO was sending out the wrong message to many would be modders.

Originally Posted by RS5ive

Perhaps Step 2 should be to organise a Group Buy for an engine strip-down & de-coke!

Sanspeed can offer a full flush of the system, I haven't looked into how effective this would be against a build up of that gunky carbon shown on the thread regarding the issue. All other information points to as you say a full engine strip down and manual cleaning.

Bear in mind it is still all still speculation that this problem even exists, I just think for <£200 it's worth sorting. Personally with my plans for a charger I would be planning on getting my engine cleaned at the point of install therefore wont be worrying about it at present but others might.

If the interest is worthwhile I will get Sanspeed to quote for both an engine flush or manual cleaning options.

[Chris_B]

Originally Posted by Spinner

Sorry for the rant and this isn't aimed specifically at you Chris_B

No worries!

I'm a little bit wary of warranty implications of any mods, as I've never been in a position to mod my cars before - they've all been company cars (half my company tho') and insured on a fleet policy, so mods have never come up. Actually if I'm honest, we've never kept them long enough to bother modding really.

The S5 will shortly be mine personally - I'm buying it off the company as it does such low mileage (~3600 miles in 15 months!), it's not worth paying company car tax on it.

Haven't decided yet how long I'll hang on to it for, but with the new S5 price list still showing the Coupe as a V8, I'll be most likely keeping it for a little while.

Add up low miles, short journeys and probably only a service every 2 years on AVS and a catch can to reduce carbon build up might be of interest. It's just my first foray into modding, so I haven't ever sounded my dealer out yet on their attitude to it...

[Graham]

Count me in please Spinner

[Spinner]

Nice one Graham, will do.

[TonCoronel]

Count me in! I live in the Netherlands and would be interested in an install-kit.

[andyhud007]

Spinner. I am also interested and I've PM'd you

Cheers

Andy

[Spinner]

Thanks for the interest guys, I've not heard back from Graham yet so will chase him over the next few days.

[Chris_B]

Haven't spoken to my dealer yet, but would like to see if any existing problem can be cleared up before putting a can on - how would I know if I'm suffering CBU? Would logging engine stats in VCDS show anything?

Suffice to say, if I'm already suffering CBU I'd like to try and wangle a cleaning under warranty - the car should be almost pristine at only 3400 miles!

Any thoughts on when you're likely to actually do this, and will the supplier allow a GB price but different install dates? I've got a little bit further to travel than some of you, so might have to switch dates about. Having said that, it'd be a nice way to meet a few of you lot.

[Spinner]

Hi Chris,

The only way you'll know if you've got the start of a build up is by having the engine opened up, unless it happens to be so bad that the car starts logging errors which is highhly unlikely with your mileage.

As I posted earlier I haven't heard back from Graham @ Sanspeed yet so no further news. I would think that within reasonable timescale it would be viable for a price to be quoted for those coming to the table at a later date but like you say a chance to meet a few fellow forum members is always enjoyable

Hope that helps.

[Chris_B]

Originally Posted by Spinner

The only way you'll know if you've got the start of a build up is by having the engine opened up, unless it happens to be so bad that the car starts logging errors which is highly unlikely with your mileage.

Ah, didn't know if loss of power was a likely symptom - could possibly log torque output with vag-com?

Anyway, I'm definitely interested, but I would like to speak to my service manager first just to get his feel for it. I've been away for a couple of days, but I'd like to get hold of him tomorrow or early next week if I can and run it past him. Life would be much easier if he gives me his support, even verbally.

Edit: BTW - I presume this would be something to declare on insurance as a modification. I would hope it wouldn't affect insurance cost, but that's something to bear in mind that it needs declaring so there's no risk of insurance being invalidated.

[andyhud007]

Morning all,

Just came across this on ebay this morning

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/PERFORMANCE-Oi...item3efdcc464c

didnt know if it might help or if its worth speaking to "JDM" who have made this one (it seems) about ones for us perhaps...

Cheers

Andy

[Spinner]

Hi Andy,

I believe this is the same brand that Sanspeed sells, the catch can own is not expensive, it's the kit to fit it and installation that bumps the price up.

For anyone unsure if this is really an issure on their FSI engine......
Taken from the 'S5 FSI engined doomed due to intake manifold carbon build-up ?'

Originally Posted by Spinner

Patrick are you confirming that to PES's knowledge this carbon build up problem definately exists on the S5 V8 engines?

Originally Posted by Patrick - PES

EVERY FSI engine I have opened up has had some level of build up on the valves and in the intake track. The worst I've seen in person was our own S5 with 25k miles +,- and the best (least build up) was on a 6k mile R8.
We have installed a number of R8 and RS4 superchargers along with direct port water meth injection. The customers are putting some serious miles on the water meth systems and are going to inspect the valves once they get about 10k miles on them. With this particular direct port setup you can just remove one of the water meth nozzles and look right down on to the back of the valves, no need to remove the manifold to inspect.
One of our local dealers has made a fantastic catch can setup for the RS4 that should be able to work with your cars

I wish I had taken pictures of all the intakes I had off, I'm going to start now.

[Graham]

Any more news Spinner?