MRC stage 2 - Audi A5 Forum & Audi S5 Forum
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post #1 of 46 Old 20th April 2017, 03:03 AM Thread Starter
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MRC stage 2

New user to A5oc but I've been reading all of your guys posts for last 2 months! Recently became a owner of an Audi S5 2015, bought from Harold wood Audi with only 7k on the clock! Coming up to 2 months of owner ship now and I'm in love with the car!
Since owning the car I got the front bonnet bumper wings, mirrors and A pillars in pfp (plastic film protection) to protect from all stone chips! Lowered on h and r springs, 15 front and 20mm spacers, tinted front windows, and wrapped the roof in black to match the sunroof. Also changed front grill to an OEM rs5 grill which I bought from Audi and my pals down at GVE in Uxbridge installed it for me. Cars been great and looks stunning for me.
Next Tuesday I'm going down to MRC tuning for a stage 2 remap with the stronic remap too, looking forward to that and then on Wednesday to Russel automotive for a milltek cat back exhaust!

Excited excited excited!???

Will update !
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post #2 of 46 Old 20th April 2017, 03:10 AM Thread Starter
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post #3 of 46 Old 20th April 2017, 03:11 AM Thread Starter
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post #4 of 46 Old 20th April 2017, 03:13 AM Thread Starter
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Don't think I need to change the rims as the car came with these 20inch oem ones and I think they look great
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post #5 of 46 Old 20th April 2017, 05:49 AM
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Great looking car? Check. Already modding? Check. Posted pix without being hounded to do so? Check. Crazy in love with the car? Check. Suddenly thinking about selling members of your immediate family to obtain funds for further mods? Unknown, but a probable Check!
Yep, sounds like the perfect A5OC forum member profile to me. Welcome aboard, Ajay.
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post #6 of 46 Old 23rd April 2017, 03:43 AM Thread Starter
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so the miltek I'm planning to get us the car back, the guys who I'm getting it from says it's race version with gt100 tips, anyone know if this will be resonated or non and the quality of this exhaust?
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post #7 of 46 Old 23rd April 2017, 11:13 AM
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Stunning car Ajay you lucky sod!!!!! Enjoy her mate, low miles or what!!!!!!

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post #8 of 46 Old 23rd April 2017, 11:16 AM Thread Starter
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Stunning car Ajay you lucky sod!!!!! Enjoy her mate, low miles or what!!!!!!
Haha cheers pal looking at doing loads! Just seen me some beautiful Roti forms im considering!!
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post #9 of 46 Old 24th April 2017, 04:48 AM
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Great looking car. Too low for me - but then I'm old and can no longer put up with worrying about the height of speed bumps!

The MRC tune is rather good...

Current: 2015 Audi S5 sportback black edition (MRC stage 2)
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post #10 of 46 Old 24th April 2017, 08:09 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks man, really have trouble getting through to them! Was wondering if they would have milteks in stock and be able to put on exhaust tomorow as well as the stage 2 and would save me going to the other place on wednesday
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post #11 of 46 Old 25th April 2017, 12:49 AM Thread Starter
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Made it! Oh the suspense lol
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post #12 of 46 Old 25th April 2017, 10:27 AM
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Well....?

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post #13 of 46 Old 25th April 2017, 12:53 PM Thread Starter
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Car successfully remapped with 477 bhp and 570nm torque! Feels amazing so fun and the s tronic remap is so good! Pushing the car to that red feeling the extra pulls is amazing, and it's true it just keeps going up up up in speed! Got my proud mrc badge on back too!
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post #14 of 46 Old 25th April 2017, 01:03 PM
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Yes, it is a bit of a different beast isn't it

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post #15 of 46 Old 26th April 2017, 02:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AjayS5 View Post
so the miltek I'm planning to get us the car back, the guys who I'm getting it from says it's race version with gt100 tips, anyone know if this will be resonated or non and the quality of this exhaust?
Race version has non-resonated rear section.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLHKGpnXy1E

Millteks are up there. Depends on if you want loud or not as there are other options.

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post #16 of 46 Old 26th April 2017, 04:32 AM
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Originally Posted by AjayS5 View Post
Car successfully remapped with 477 bhp and 570nm torque! Feels amazing so fun and the s tronic remap is so good! Pushing the car to that red feeling the extra pulls is amazing, and it's true it just keeps going up up up in speed! Got my proud mrc badge on back too!
I know exactly how you feel!

Sorry to be pedantic but it is 477 PS peak, which is about 470 bhp. It's nice to see an MRC dyno starting at less than 1500rpm. Comparing that torque curve to those of turbo cars clearly demonstrates the advantage of the supercharger!

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post #17 of 46 Old 26th April 2017, 04:45 AM
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Comparing that torque curve to those of turbo cars clearly demonstrates the advantage of the supercharger!
Yup. Having recently become more interested in this Audi seem to tune their cars for a flat torque to ~5000-5200 and then start dropping torque to give constant hp. Have seen this on a few cars (including mine) now and also on the attached which is off the new S5/RS5 (nicked from another forum).
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post #18 of 46 Old 26th April 2017, 11:13 AM Thread Starter
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I've noticed a funny thing though, all has been good and well but whilst driving I've realized that sometimes like in around gear 3 if I floor the car pedal all the way down to the floor, in auto s mode, the car will go all the way to 7000 revs but not change gear, it will just drop my revs to 5000 and stabilize there for a second before I can change gear? Strange??? I've been reading up and sure it's not a slipping clutch but might be torque converter locking?????

Ideas?
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post #19 of 46 Old 26th April 2017, 11:14 AM Thread Starter
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post #20 of 46 Old 27th April 2017, 04:00 AM
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Originally Posted by arad85 View Post
Yup. Having recently become more interested in this Audi seem to tune their cars for a flat torque to ~5000-5200 and then start dropping torque to give constant hp. Have seen this on a few cars (including mine) now and also on the attached which is off the new S5/RS5 (nicked from another forum).
Note quite. The 'plateau' is because the wastegate(s) open(s). The fall in torque at the high end is simply the limit of gas flow due to turbo size vs engine capacity: As the engine revs higher it sucks more air but the turbo can't keep up and so the boost drops.

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I've noticed a funny thing though, all has been good and well but whilst driving I've realized that sometimes like in around gear 3 if I floor the car pedal all the way down to the floor, in auto s mode, the car will go all the way to 7000 revs but not change gear, it will just drop my revs to 5000 and stabilize there for a second before I can change gear? Strange??? I've been reading up and sure it's not a slipping clutch but might be torque converter locking?????

Ideas?
Well its not the torque converter locking because you don't have one - the DL501 is a dual wet clutch gearbox. However what you describe doesn't seem right (and mine has not done that) so I think you ought to get it checked.

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post #21 of 46 Old 27th April 2017, 07:19 AM
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Note quite. The 'plateau' is because the wastegate(s) open(s). The fall in torque at the high end is simply the limit of gas flow due to turbo size vs engine capacity: As the engine revs higher it sucks more air but the turbo can't keep up and so the boost drops.
But my stock S5 exhibited exactly the same behaviour on a stock tune....

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post #22 of 46 Old 28th April 2017, 04:57 AM
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OK, I'll try to explain. In a turbo engine the boost pressure is governed by the difference in airflow through the turbo and that through the engine. So obviously whilst the turbo is spinning a lot faster that the engine is revving, then its pushing air and a boost pressure is created. As you know engine torque is proportional to boost, and so the torque curve you see from the dyno of a tuned car (i.e. one which is not 'artificially' limited by wastegate control) shows the boost: Low before the turbo spools, then rapidly peaking as it achieves is capacity, and then tailing off as the engine sucks more and more air such that the pressure tails off. The wastegate control is primarily to protect the whole engine by limiting maximum boost to whatever is considered safe. But OEMs want it lower. Part of that decision must be for reliability/longevity, I guess part is for emissions/economy and probably part for driveability (less peaky acceleration). So the OEM ECU map simply opens the wastegate at a given pressure, flattening the boost curve and hence the torque curve. In terms of load management a turbo engine relies on a combination of the throttle valve to limit airflow into the engine and diverter (or in older engines dump) valves to limit backpressure when the valve is closed.

A supercharger does not have the equivalent of a wastegate. The crank is permanently connected to the rotors (although I admit I am unfamiliar with how the clutch operates in the CREC supercharger). So it needs a bypass valve inside the supercharger which acts in the same way as the diverter valve acts for a turbo engine. The difference here is that the bypass valve works together with the throttle valve to perform load management. The OEM ECU map limits boost by always having the valve partly open, so bleeding boost. This affects the whole boost/torque curve, and not just the part of it where boost has exceeded a limit as in a turbo engine. A remap allows the valve to close so that full boost can reach the manifold, however the overall boost/torque curve shape is mostly unaffected.

I'm not sure if I have explained that very well. Maybe others can help clarify.
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post #23 of 46 Old 28th April 2017, 08:05 AM
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I'm not sure if I have explained that very well. Maybe others can help clarify.
Nope. Not needed. What you wrote is how I thought it all worked. What confused me was you use of the word turbo in your reply.

I think what I am saying is that Audi purposely engineer the torque curve to be flat by bleeding boost to give a constant and predictable "feel". I suspect they also reduce slightly boost pressure again above 5000ish rpm to then give consistent hp. Whether the boost is by turbo or supercharger, I think they engineer their curves to look like that. Whilst I can't share my stock curve, there is a definite kink in the hp from rising to almost flat at the point the torque curve starts falling significantly. HP is then flat-ish until the rev limiter is reached which is another 1000rpm on from when the torque curve drops.

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post #24 of 46 Old 28th April 2017, 06:49 PM Thread Starter
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[QUOTE=Dippy;1406553]OK, I'll try to explain. In a turbo engine the boost pressure is governed by the difference in airflow through the turbo and that through the engine. So obviously whilst the turbo is spinning a lot faster that the engine is revving, then its pushing air and a boost pressure is created. As you know engine torque is proportional to boost, and so the torque curve you see from the dyno of a tuned car (i.e. one which is not 'artificially' limited by wastegate control) shows the boost: Low before the turbo spools, then rapidly peaking as it achieves is capacity, and then tailing off as the engine sucks more and more air such that the pressure tails off. The wastegate control is primarily to protect the whole engine by limiting maximum boost to whatever is considered safe. But OEMs want it lower. Part of that decision must be for reliability/longevity, I guess part is for emissions/economy and probably part for driveability (less peaky acceleration). So the OEM ECU map simply opens the wastegate at a given pressure, flattening the boost curve and hence the torque curve. In terms of load management a turbo engine relies on a combination of the throttle valve to limit airflow into the engine and diverter (or in older engines dump) valves to limit backpressure when the valve is closed.

A supercharger does not have the equivalent of a wastegate. The crank is permanently connected to the rotors (although I admit I am unfamiliar with how the clutch operates in the CREC supercharger). So it needs a bypass valve inside the supercharger which acts in the same way as the diverter valve acts for a turbo engine. The difference here is that the bypass valve works together with the throttle valve to perform load management. The OEM ECU map limits boost by always having the valve partly open, so bleeding boost. This affects the whole boost/torque curve, and not just the part of it where boost has exceeded a limit as in a turbo engine. A remap allows the valve to close so that full boost can reach the manifold, however the overall boost/torque curve shape is mostly unaffected.

I'm not sure if I have explained that very well. Maybe others can help clarify.[/QUOTE

So is something wrong wth mine or is it normal and just protecting me? I'm co fused
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post #25 of 46 Old 29th April 2017, 12:27 AM
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So is something wrong wth mine or is it normal and just protecting me? I'm co fused
You mean the floor it, downshift followed by no gear change (although you say it drops to 5000rpm for a while...)? I'd check with MRC. They know how their gearbox remap should work...

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post #26 of 46 Old 29th April 2017, 02:46 AM
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Originally Posted by arad85 View Post
I think what I am saying is that Audi purposely engineer the torque curve to be flat by bleeding boost to give a constant and predictable "feel". I suspect they also reduce slightly boost pressure again above 5000ish rpm to then give consistent hp. Whether the boost is by turbo or supercharger, I think they engineer their curves to look like that. Whilst I can't share my stock curve, there is a definite kink in the hp from rising to almost flat at the point the torque curve starts falling significantly. HP is then flat-ish until the rev limiter is reached which is another 1000rpm on from when the torque curve drops.
Yes, agreed. I was only pointing out that the flatness of torque curve for a turbo engine is merely because a boost threshold is reached which causes the wastegate to open. Then at higher revs it falls again not due to the control system but merely because the turbo can no longer sustain boost as the engine revs rise.

As to your stock power curve, yes mine is the same. However compare the slope of the torque at this point to that of your stage 2. The stock slope is steeper which is why the power is flat when the stage 2 power is still rising. Remember that power = torque x angular velocity, so there is a simple relationship between the power curve and the torque curve.

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You mean the floor it, downshift followed by no gear change (although you say it drops to 5000rpm for a while...)? I'd check with MRC. They know how their gearbox remap should work...
Ajay, if you are sure that revs reach 7K but then drop to 5K WITHOUT gear change then that can only be either clutch slip (seems unlikely) or something is causing the engine to intentionally drop the revs by closing the throttle slightly. You must discuss this with MRC.
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post #27 of 46 Old 2nd May 2017, 02:31 AM
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Ajay I think we briefly met at MRC this morning (I was in getting my stage 2). Great looking car in the flesh, though needs a wash ;-)


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post #28 of 46 Old 2nd May 2017, 05:56 PM Thread Starter
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Ajay I think we briefly met at MRC this morning (I was in getting my stage 2). Great looking car in the flesh, though needs a wash ;-)


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Hey pal yeah I think we did around 10:30/11am? Haha how you finding the remap, mines all sorted now I found out it was something just as stupid as the alignment that was playing tricks on my car! And yeah got it washed when I got it back home, all clean gleaming white now lol, was full of roadkill this morning?
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post #29 of 46 Old 3rd May 2017, 12:07 AM
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mines all sorted now I found out it was something just as stupid as the alignment that was playing tricks on my car!
Glad you're all sorted, but what was up with the car?

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post #30 of 46 Old 3rd May 2017, 03:25 AM
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Hey pal yeah I think we did around 10:30/11am? Haha how you finding the remap?

Yep that was me!
The map... still wearing a big grin!


2013 Audi S5 Sportback Black Edition - Mods: MRC Stage 2 (Inc DSG remap), Oil Dipstick ;-)

2013 Audi S5 Sportback Black Edition - Mods: MRC Stage 2 (Inc DSG remap), Oil Dipstick ;-)
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